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Offline Coconut

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Left Side Control Plate Removal - Damaged T40 Bolt head !
« on: November 15, 2020, 05:03:56 pm »
It's that time of year for regular maintenance and cleaning,
so I decided to pull the Left Control Plate ( Footrest Hanger ),
in order to remove the Gear Change Pedal Pivot Bolt and replace it
with a modified bolt, as discussed elsewhere in the Forum.

First remove the Plastic Heel Guard ( 2 x 5mm Button Head Allen bolts ),
to reveal the Lower Rear Subframe Bolt.
Remove the bolt using a 14mm Socket and a 14mm spanner to hold the nut.

Next, remove the Sidestand bolt next to the Footrest ( 8mm Allen key ). 
There's no need to fully remove the Sidestand.

This leaves the three T40 Torx bolts.
These bolts have Thread Locking compound applied to them,
and although they had been removed previously,
what remained of the compound was still doing a good job !

The lower T40 Torx bolt decided to stay where it was,
and due to a combination of the Thread Locking compound,
the Bolt Head and my T40 Bit being slightly worn, not to mention
a little ham-fistedness, I managed to "bugger it up" !  :138:



After a lot of head scratching and consulting fellow Member and engineering Guru "1675",
I carefully used a 4.8mm drill bit to drill the hole within the Bolt about 5mm deeper.
( A 4.8mm drill clears the exisiting "teeth" of the Torx bolt so as not to damage them further ).

I bought some T40 Torx Impact Bits and using a Manual Impact Driver
hammered one of the Bits into the Bolt head.   
The extra 5mm depth of hole and the hardened steel of the
Impact Bit alllowed the Bit to be forced further into the bolt
sufficiently enough to grip and be unscrewed - Phew !

If that hadn't worked the next step would have been to use a 10mm diameter drill bit
( being the size of the plain section of the bolt that fits through the Control Plate
and locates into the Frame ),  to carefully drill the head off the bolt and allow the Control Plate
to slide over it and be removed, and then use Mole Grips on the remaining protruding stud.



After removing that troublesome bolt, plus the other two T40 Torx bolts,
and freeing the Power Socket mounting plate from the two rubber grommets,
the Control Plate could be removed.



A new bolt ( T2020609 ) was purchased to replace the damaged one,
but before using it the Thread Locking compound was cleaned from it,
and also from the other two Torx bolts, using a wire brush.




The original Gear Pedal Bolt was removed, and I also took the opportunity
to change the Seals on the Gear Lever Linkage Ball Joints,
cleaning and greasing them before fitting the new modified pivot bolt.



Finally, before refitting the Side Control Plate, I ran an M8 x 1.25 Tap in and out
of the mounting holes in the frame a few times, including the Gear Pedal Pivot bolt
hole which is the same thread, to remove the last traces of Thread Locking Compound.



I applied a light smear of Copper Grease to the Torx and Gear Pedal bolts.

Position the Side Control Plate and fit the Torx bolts but don't tighten
them at this stage which will make it easier to line up the mounting hole
for the Lower Rear Subframe Bolt. 

Once the Subframe bolt has been fitted, but not yet tightened,
fit the Footrest bolt, but again don't fully tighten it yet.

Ensure the Control plate is positioned correctly against the frame mounting points, and the
10mm shoulder of the bolts are sitting inside the holes of the Control Plate, tighten the Torx bolts. 
( The Service Manual says to tighten them to 25Nm )
 
Tighten the Rear Subframe bolt to 60Nm and the Sidestand bolt to 45Nm.

The process is similar for the Right Control Plate, giving access to the Rear
Brake Pedal Pivot bolt, but without the Sidestand and Rear Subframe bolts to contend with.

As the Thread Locking compound has been removed,
I will be regularly checking the Torx bolts to ensure they are still tight.

« Last Edit: November 26, 2020, 06:39:19 pm by Coconut »

Offline trophied

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Re: Left Side Control Plate Removal - Damaged T40 Bolt head !
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2020, 05:24:08 pm »
Thread chaser would probably be a good solution to clean up the thread locker left behind, and would likely get closer to the bottom of the threads of a blind hole.  Of course our Guru coconut already knows all those things, so this isn't for his benefit.  Great tip from 1675 for possible removal of a damaged torx head bolt.  Thanks for sharing.
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Offline Canes1

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Re: Left Side Control Plate Removal - Damaged T40 Bolt head !
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2020, 09:53:03 pm »
I seem to remember that particular bolt being a pita, while one of the others I had to tap and buy a new bolt! :172:

Offline Saddle Tramp

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Re: Left Side Control Plate Removal - Damaged T40 Bolt head !
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2020, 02:12:41 pm »
That was me, but mine had actually been cross-threaded from the Factory.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2020, 02:14:14 pm by Saddle Tramp »
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Offline STJIM

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Re: Left Side Control Plate Removal - Damaged T40 Bolt head !
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2020, 06:32:09 pm »
Lucky that did the trick for you Coconut.

I had the same problem ( really tight plate mounting Torx bolts ) but on the right side plate.  I tried using an impact wrench set at only "2" instead of full pressure and I still managed to cracked off the end of the Torx bit.

I had a similar problem removing an 8mm bolt that held a frame rail on my Concours a year ago.  Really tight because of the locking compound applied to a new bolt.  I don't like that stuff.  I remove it and use the liquid ( blue ) locktite usually. 

So  I applied heat with my propane torch to the end of the bolt on the Concours and it spun right out, easily.

So I decided I'd try also using some heat with the Trophy and thought I would probably have to repaint the cover because of heat damage from the propane torch.  Surprisingly, the torch didn't harm the paint at all and the heat did the job to loosen the locking compound on Torx bolts threads.

I was prepared to have to do the same on the left side plate, but those came out without too much much of a problem - go figure.

I was removing the plates to install the upgraded mounting shoulder bolts for the gear shift  and rear brake levers.  I did wind up modifying one of the old shoulder bolts and using it on the rear brake lever.

I removed all the old locking compound from the plate mounting Torx bolts, coated the threads with copper anti-seize and will just check them periodically for tightness.  I bet they will never loosen.
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Offline RocketSteve

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Re: Left Side Control Plate Removal - Damaged T40 Bolt head !
« Reply #5 on: November 28, 2020, 02:30:50 pm »
Ha, add my name to that list!

I replaced all those nasty T40 bolts both sides years ago when the bike 1st fell over in Italy.

Now have Stainless Allen bolts fitted so it's much easier if I need to do any repairs road-side etc.

EDIT: I'd make a suggestion here - place a socket over the head of any bolt that has threadlock and direct a pencil beam of a gas torch into the socket to warm up the bolt (the socket keeps the heat focused on the bolt rather than the surrounding frame) which softens the threadlock and releases it's grip.
It does work, trust me.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2020, 02:44:57 pm by RocketSteve »
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Offline STJIM

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Re: Left Side Control Plate Removal - Damaged T40 Bolt head !
« Reply #6 on: November 28, 2020, 05:20:28 pm »
RocketMan :

Good idea : You may have mentioned that previously in another post and I did try that first. I don't have a pencil torch, only a propane/MAPP torch and it just doesn't produce enough "focused" heat and that didn't work. The socket got nice & hot tho.

So I tried applying the heat without using a socket to protect the surrounding plate area and after about a minute or so of applying heat, I managed to soften up the locking agent a bit.  It still took some torque to break the three Torx's loose ( about the same as the opposite side without heat ) , but I managed to remove them, thankfully.

When I used heat on the protruding ends of the sub-frame mounting bolts on my Concours, after heating the bolts spun right out without requiring much torque at all.  So heat does the trick on that locking compound.

I remember reading an article years ago by Smokey Unick who built auto racing engines. He said to remove head studs that have been epoxied in place, apply some heat first.  A torch does come in handy at times.
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Re: Left Side Control Plate Removal - Damaged T40 Bolt head !
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2020, 10:36:10 am »
If you replaced the original torx screws with M8 cap screws, did you make up a couple of spacers 8mm id and 10mm od to align the plate when remounting. I thought about doing this last time I had it apart, but will be doing it next week.

 



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