Author [NL] [FR] [ES] [DE] [SE] [IT] Valve shims conundrum  (Read 540 times)

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  • Offline MidnightSE

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    Offline MidnightSE

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    Valve shims conundrum
    on: Sep 17, 2023, 10.09 am
    Sep 17, 2023, 10.09 am
    Since I cannot ride, rotator calf recovery, I wanted to perform deep dive and check-adjust valves. Not a hugely big job, but...
    After measuring valves, min vs max feeler gauge approach, I've determined pretty much all valves are under.
     
    My question is how critical is it to go beyond max setting on valve clearance on Hinckley triple engines?

    For example. The Exhaust valve clearance is .10mm and the shim is 2.30mm. If I use 2.25mm shim would it not send the setting above the max .13mm?

    I've used online shim calculator to get results.  And according to calculation, in the above case I should use 2.28mm shim to bring it up to within spec valve clearance.

    What do you guys think?

    P.S
    Hot Cams doesn't make shims in .01mm increments, only 0.5mm

    Cheers...


    Last Edit: Sep 17, 2023, 10.12 am by MidnightSE

  • Offline nert   us

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    Offline nert

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    Re: Valve shims conundrum
    Reply #1 on: Sep 17, 2023, 01.13 pm
    Sep 17, 2023, 01.13 pm
    I didnít consult my service book, but recently having adjusted my valves, I thought intake clearance is .100 to .150, exhaust .275 to .325?

  • Offline Coconut   gb

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    Re: Valve shims conundrum
    Reply #2 on: Sep 17, 2023, 02.36 pm
    Sep 17, 2023, 02.36 pm
    Confirmed that the Service Manual ( Chapter 3 Page 18 ) states :
     
    Inlet 0.10 to 0.15mm
    Exhaust 0.275 to 0.325mm

    As the components wear, due to the design,
    the valve clearance will REDUCE.

    I don't understand the comment : "...would it not send the setting above the max .13mm?"

    PLEASE NOTE : It is incredibly easy to get the Maths wrong here !
    I have never adjusted the valve clearances on my Trophy
    and I urge you to CHECK with an independent reliable / qualified source
    that the following information is correct BEFORE using it to adjust your valves ! ! !


    When the measured Clearance is too small, you need to replace the shim
    with a SMALLER one - which will therefore INCREASE the amount of clearance.

    e.g. Measured Clearance ( Exhaust ) = 0.10mm, Shim installed is 2.30mm.

    The Required Clearance = 0.275mm to 0.325mm so your actual clearance of 0.10mm
    is between 0.175mm ( 0.275 minus 0.10 ) to 0.225mm ( 0.325 minus 0.10 ) smaller than specified.

    To adjust the clearance to within specification you need to replace the current shim
    with one that is between 2.125mm ( 2.3 minus 0.175 ) and 2.075mm ( 2.3 minus 0.225 )



    Again quoting from the Service Manual :

    Camshaft, valve, shim and valve seat wear affects the
    valve clearances.  The effect of this wear is to change the
    gap between the camshaft and tappet bucket, causing
    engine noise and improper running.  If the valve
    clearances become too small, permanent danage to the
    valve and valve seat will take place.  If the valve clearance
    becomes too great, the engine will become noisy and will
    not run correctly.

    Other than from Triumph, "Pro-X" in the U.S. have 9.5mm diameter Valve shims in 0.025 increments.

    Cheers  :821:







    Last Edit: Sep 17, 2023, 09.05 pm by Coconut

  • Offline MidnightSE

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    Offline MidnightSE

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    Re: Valve shims conundrum
    Reply #3 on: Sep 17, 2023, 03.13 pm
    Sep 17, 2023, 03.13 pm
    My bad, I mixed up SAE and Metric.
    It is not .10 mm it is .10 inches which is .254mm. Which is still below min spec of .275mm
    So to bring it back up to max clearance of .325 I will need -070mm shim. (.325-.254)
    Given existing shim is 2.30mm, I need to subtract .070mm from it. So the shim of 2.25 mm would bring the clearance closer to .325mm clearance.

    Does it sound plausible?

    Cheers...

  • Offline janfmiller   us

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    Offline janfmiller

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    Re: Valve shims conundrum
    Reply #4 on: Sep 17, 2023, 03.22 pm
    Sep 17, 2023, 03.22 pm
    Be sure and measure the OLD shim, to be sure you are starting with the correct shim thickness.
    Just a good habit...  :062:
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  • Offline nert   us

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    Offline nert

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    Re: Valve shims conundrum
    Reply #5 on: Sep 18, 2023, 05.04 pm
    Sep 18, 2023, 05.04 pm
    When performing a valve adjustment at 24k, my valves were tight. At my 74k adjustment, the valves were loose. Each time needing to have shims replaced. And rechecked before completing assembly.

    As the components wear, due to the design,
    the valve clearance will REDUCE.
    .

    Valve clearance changes due to wear in several areas of the valve train. Newly built heads will be more prone to clearance reducing as the thin margin area on the valve seat begins to "pound in" allowing the valve to sit deeper in the seat, and the stem section to sit taller towards the inverted bucket. This action will slow as the valve margin widens, due to increased margin surface area will more easily resist accelerated seat area deforming. The remainder of the valve train also experiences wear, (loss of metal) on the bucket surface, the cam lobe and the cam upper bearing journal all allowing clearances to increase. That wear will continue for the life of the engine. Engines that use rockers and push rods have additional areas of contact and wear and may increase valve clearance at a faster rate.

  • Online trophied   us

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    Re: Valve shims conundrum
    Reply #6 on: Sep 18, 2023, 05.47 pm
    Sep 18, 2023, 05.47 pm
    I can't help it, gotta love me some hydraulic lash adjusters!  If Harley did it with a high RPM redline like the Pan America, everybody CAN do it. :009:
    One of the Founding Members of the Twisted Trophies

  • Offline MidnightSE

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    Offline MidnightSE

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    Re: Valve shims conundrum
    Reply #7 on: Sep 18, 2023, 11.43 pm
    Sep 18, 2023, 11.43 pm
    Revolution Max engine is a marvel of engineering for sure.