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Offline csquared

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Audio vs Helmet Intercom Issues
« on: March 25, 2014, 01:46:53 am »
Well folks, I'm going out on a limb here. Please comment as needed to correct any inaccuracies as needed.

When an intercom headset is connected to the Trophy's Audio System:

     1. A fully functional volume control is disabled. In other words when pressing the volume up/down buttons a volume indicator bar is displayed and the volume is increased/decreased. There are some oddities here.

     2. AVC (automatic volume control) is disabled.

     3. All other audio control functions work correctly.

Oddities:

Cardo Scala G9 (w8d4it), G4 including Schuberth SRCS and Interphone F3XT (davybull) allow the audio systems volume control to work but without the volume bar indicator displayed. I have not a clue why.

Discussion:

I have three (3) different intercom headsets and each is similar but yet different.

     1. Chatterbox X1Bluetooth
              Intercom volume control works
              Bike volume control does not work
              Intercom AVC is not implemented
              Bike AVC does not work

     2. Schubert SRCS (Cardo Scala G4)
              Intercom volume control works
              Bike volume control works but without volume indicator bar
              Intercom AVC works (cannot be turned off)
              Bike AVC turned off (assumed as I've noticed no conflict)

     3. Sena SMH10R
              Intercom volume control works
              Bike volume control does not work
              Intercom AVC is not implemented
              Bike AVC does not work

My thoughts

When one connects a Bluetooth headset (intercom) to the audio system:

     The bikes AVC is turned off; no exceptions.
     The bikes volume control indicator is hidden.
     The bikes volume control works for some headsets.

A strong suggestion to Mother Triumph (if you are listening):

      Leave both the AVC and volume controls on the bike alone! Do not turn them off as a default when a Bluetooth headset (intercom) is connected.

      AVC has four (4) settings; high, medium, low and off. If we have a headset that has not implemented AVC such as the Chatterbox X1 Bluetooth or Sena SMH10R we could use the high, medium or low settings. For devices like the Cardo G9 or G4 we could turn it off and utilize the headsets implementation.

     Volume control with the indicator should always be active; keeps the hands near the hand grips (think safety). One should be able to control the volume of each device independently as needed.

     You might give us an option to turn the bike's volume control off or on. That would at least give those who want to control the volume with the headset an option but I would rather set the headset volume once and use the handlebar controls to set/reset the volume as needed.

Well, I've had my say.




 
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Offline DonTom

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Re: Audio vs Helmet Intercom Issues
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2014, 02:46:09 am »
I wish I could turn off the AVC in my G9. The way it is, I have to adjust the volume with my windscreen height. Low for way too loud and up for radio way too low in volume.  I have tried all G9 AVC settings, "AVC off"  is not an option.

-Don-  SSF, CA

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Offline Zaphod

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Re: Audio vs Helmet Intercom Issues
« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2014, 01:00:42 am »
Csquared....

I can go some way to explaining why you can alter the headset volume from the bars on some units but not others.

Deep breath...........

The Trophy's bluetooth supports the two standard bluetooth profiles for streaming stereo music (A2DP) & the one which allows remote volume control of an attached device (AVRCP). The attached device - in this case the headset - must also support both these profiles in order for everything to work as intended, so if your headset only supports A2DP then you can stream stereo sound to the headset - at a preset volume - but not control the volume from the handlebars. Your headset must support AVRCP to do that.  Only some - by no means all - bluetooth headsets support AVRCP, hence the mixed results people are having with functionality.

As to why the AVC and volume display are disabled I can't even begin to guess!  Possibly a way of getting around issues AVC might cause with remote volume control crashing the bluetooth stack? Who can say?

As a quick aside it's worth pointing out that only one of the Trophy's 2 bluetooth interfaces supports both profiles.

It might be interesting, not to mention useful, to conduct a straw pole on the forum as to who has had success with bluetooth volume control and if so with which headset.
If you can keep your head when all about you are loosing theirs, it's a sure sign you've misread the situation.

Offline csquared

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Re: Audio vs Helmet Intercom Issues
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2014, 02:09:41 am »
Zaphod,

Thanks for your reply. I did a bit of research on AVRCP just to see if the handle bar control for the volume worked on all headsets that supported it (AVRCP). Both my Sena SMH10R and SRCS (Cardo Scala G4) support AVRCP. The SRCS works with handle bar volume control (no volume indicator) while the Sena does not.

More research indicated that there are 4 implementations of AVRCP; 1.0, 1.3, 1.4 and 1.5 with possible vendor extensions. I'd bet that there are some incompatibilities here!

Your aside leads me to think that Headset 1 supports HFP, A2DP and AVRCP (in some form - maybe; sometimes) and that Device 2 supports HFP and A2DP.

The idea of a straw pole is a great idea.

Thanks
Chuck
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Offline MikeDH

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Re: Audio vs Helmet Intercom Issues
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2014, 05:45:40 pm »
FWIW I can confirm my SCRS works with the handle bar volume control, but my Sena SMH-10 does not (both running latest firmware updates). Not a big deal for me that the bike's volume control does not work with the Sena, as the SMH-10 has a very user friendly jog dial volume control. Even though it requires removing my hand from the handle bar, I would have to do that to adjust the bike's volume control  as well - given it's somewhat awkward location.
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Offline Roger

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Re: Audio vs Helmet Intercom Issues
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2014, 06:08:27 pm »
Don

I believe your way of volume adjustment dates back to gramophone days of volume control !  :002:

Roger

Offline w8d4it

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Re: Audio vs Helmet Intercom Issues
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2014, 10:24:53 pm »
On the Scala G9 the AVC feature is termed Automatic Gain Control "AGC" and can be set from your Cardo Community connection in the software you installed on your PC. 
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Offline DonTom

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Re: Audio vs Helmet Intercom Issues
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2014, 10:54:53 pm »
*Originally Posted by w8d4it [+]
On the Scala G9 the AVC feature is termed Automatic Gain Control "AGC" and can be set from your Cardo Community connection in the software you installed on your PC.
Yes, & I have tried all three AGC settings. Volume still too low when the windscreen is high on any of the three settings. I can make it loud enough as long as there is wind noise. The best volume control for the G9 is the TTSE windshield height. Down for more volume, up for low audio that is hard to hear on any of the three AGC settings, with the G9 volume all the way to max.

The only G9 AGC setting  I want is "AGC OFF" which is not an option.

My N-Com B1 has no AGC and works perfectly on my TTSE. I can turn it loud enough to hurt my ears at any speed, any windshield height. When I stop, or slow down it  might be a bit too loud and the bike's volume doesn't work with it. However, the TTSE mute function works fine with the B1 (hold "volume - " for a couple of seconds to mute).  It's a small hassle to lower the volume on the B1 itself. I would rather be able to use the bike's controls.

Over all, I am MUCH more happy with the N-Com B1 than the G9.  Not only is it much louder when it's quiet because of the no AGC, IMO, it sounds better too.

I assume the G9 AGC will work well on noisy bikes that have no or a very small windshield.  With the G9, the more noise the better, because of the stupid AGC that does not have a good setting for a more quiet touring bike. It just won't go to maximum volume  on any of the AGC settings unless there is quite a bit of noise.

IOW, the AGC on the G9 works way too well for a TTSE. All the AGC does is prevents it from gong near  maximum possible volume when it's quiet. Stupid design, IMO.

-Don-  Reno, NV
1971 Black BMW R75/5/* 1984 Red Yamaha Venture* 2002 Yellow Suzuki DR200SE* 2013 Blue Triumph Trophy SE*2016 Orange/Black Kaw Versy 650 LT*2016 Orange Moto Guzzi Stelvio* 2017 Gold/Black Harley FLTRU RoadGlide Ultra*2017 Zero 6.5DS* 2017 Zero SR13 w/Pwr Tank*2020 Energica SS9

 



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