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Offline Trophy 59

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Re: When Safety take Precedence over Cool
« Reply #24 on: July 09, 2013, 10:24:12 am »
It also depends a lot on where you ride. If it is often dark, wet and gloomy in the UK (I nearly said Pommie Land then - please forgive) I can see the need for reflective gear and additional lights etc.

Additional lights and reflective gear are not the go over here where traffic is generally lighter, days brighter, rarely rains. It is actually quite rare to see any hi-vis on a rider or a bike.

If I was commuting to and from in the dark and in the rain a fair bit, I think my ideas would change pretty quick.
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Offline BluePilot

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Re: When Safety take Precedence over Cool
« Reply #25 on: July 09, 2013, 12:50:04 pm »
RAS, what you say is true, all (civilan) bikers have the same rights- as do all other motorists. However, as I often say to my "advanced" students- it is no good being in the right but DEAD!

It is a fact that riders using some form of conspicuity, be it hi-viz clothing, bike livery or running lights are LESS LIKELY to be involved in accidents. Nobody is accident proof. My last major accident was when I was riding an ST1100, headlights on and wearing a hi-viz harness. It was broad daylight and at low speed (about 15mph). The driver pulled out of a side turning on the offside, came across the road and hit the back of the bike. He had seen me, he just musjudged the rate of closure and mishandled the car- the reason? He was drunk.

If somebody chooses to ride all in black with no lights it is entirely up to them and they are simply accepting that they have a higher probability of having an accident. I choose to be conspicuous and maximise the chances of other motorists seeing me and accounting for my presence in their driving plan. The chances of having an accident are reduced if BOTH parties are accounting for eachother. If you don't give the other party the best chance to see you you are already eroding your safety margins before you start.

EVERYBODY makes mistakes. On the day that we make the mistake it may be the other party that has to avoid an accident. If they haven't seen you then how can they? Yes, you can argue about drivers on their phones or being otherwise distracted, but these are a minority and most drivers are watching the road and are likely to see you.

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Offline RAS

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Re: When Safety take Precedence over Cool
« Reply #26 on: July 09, 2013, 02:49:07 pm »
A degree of in built conspicuity is on all new bikes since about the year 2000 with the advent of compulsory lights. I believe that if you ride like everyone else is trying to kill you, then you will be as safe as you can be.
It is all about the risk level acceptable to the individual. You can reduce the risk even more by getting in a car or better still a tank if that is how you feel safest!! Plenty of cheese layers in a tank :008: :008:
That is a personal choice, as is riding a bike in the first place.
I certainly don't think we should all be deliberately stealthy, but there has to be a ballance, and in my opinion striping the bike up to look like a member of the highways agency or one of our illustrious police vehicles is too much, in my humble. Where do you stop? You might as well go the whole hog and have a siren as well to go with the fireworks!! (And some drunk will still knock you off!! :233:).
BP, It is your bike to do with as you see fit.
I just hope that such high viz clothing etc is never made compulsory. It is not a matter of protection like the crash helmet. Freedom of choice and each to their own and all that.

Offline Trumpet

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Re: When Safety take Precedence over Cool
« Reply #27 on: July 09, 2013, 06:23:04 pm »
To be cool or to be visible? That's the fundamental existential question of a biker.. :107:
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Offline cropbiker

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Re: When Safety take Precedence over Cool
« Reply #28 on: July 09, 2013, 10:32:00 pm »
Look at it another way.....

How many times after a cager has taken out a biker have they mentioned the phrase...l

"I just didn't see him!"
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