Author [NL] [FR] [ES] [DE] [SE] [IT] Topic: No Horn, Front & Rear Position Lights or Brake Light.  (Read 11450 times)

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  • Offline Coconut   gb

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    No Horn, Front & Rear Position Lights or Brake Light.
    on: Jun 25, 2019, 09.06 am
    Jun 25, 2019, 09.06 am
    I've started this separate Topic, for clarity, but Members should also refer to this Topic,
    if the wiring at the Fusebox, as described below, is found to be intact :

    Ignition Switch Wiring Failures.
    ( Where a break of certain wires at the Ignition switch can result in this, and other faults ).

    Fuse No.6 ( 15A ) of the Rear Fusebox, controls the Horn, Position Lights, Brake Light,
    and Top Box Power ( when the Top Box optionn has been fitted ).

    Remove the left side panel to access the Fuseboxes.
    ( Disconnect the Heated Seat Switch if fitted
    so the Panel can be placed out of harms way ! ).




    Using test equipment, check that Fuse No.6 ( 15A ) is intact.




    Next, using a suitable Voltmeter, ( or Bulb and wires ), remove he Fuse and check
    that there is Voltage at the Input side of the Fuse ( the side nearest the centre of the bike ).
    Main Battery voltage should be present at this terminal with the Ignition OFF :




    If Voltage is present at the Input side of the Fuse, and the Fuse is intact,
    there should be Voltage present at the Output side of the fuse when the fuse is inserted,
    and out via the Orange wire running to the Ignition Switch Multi Plug, and a second wire
    coloured Green with a Brown Stripe to the Top Box Power Relay.

    The wires underneath the Fusebox are tricky to get at, and need a little careful dismantling.
    Take into account that there are permanently LIVE wires entering the Fusebox,
    so it is recommended that the Main Battery is disconnected prior to dismantling,
    to guard against any inadvertent Short circuits to the frame !

    Depress the catch in the side of the twin Relay Housing attached to the Fusebox,
    lift the Relays Housing up, and move it out of the way. 

    If the Heated Rider seat option is fitted, Depress the catch on the side of the connector
    just rearwards of the Fusebox, and then lift the Connector socket upwards off its Mounting bracket
    and position it out of the way.

    The Rear fusebox can then be removed from its bracket - depress the catch and lift the fusebox upwards.

    There is not a lot of slack in the wiring loom, but the Fusebox can then be CAREFULLY manoeuvred
    around the various brackets until it can be turned upside down to examine the contacts underneath.

    The large Brown wire shown below provides Power to the Input side of Fuse No.5,
    which is connected via a metal strip to Fuse No.6 ( and others ) as shown.

    Check the integrity of the wiring and connections using Test equipment,
    and check the wiring loom for any signs of chafing or damage.




    If any problems are found with the Fusebox or wiring, a repaiir will be needed -
    the Fusebox is integral to the main Harness and is not available as a separate part.

    If all is well, refer back to the Ignition Switch Wiring Fault Topic mentioned at the start of this Message.


     
    Last Edit: Jan 07, 2020, 09.05 pm by Coconut

  • Offline rpeters549   us

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    Re: No Horn, Front & Rear Position Lights or Brake Light.
    Reply #1 on: Jun 29, 2019, 05.41 pm
    Jun 29, 2019, 05.41 pm
    I know this thread was partially started because of me (yup, ignorant troublemaker at times).  I checked power just to the fuse (removed fuse and used multi meter across the two fuse box contacts and got nothing).  I will double check just the 'live' side later today grounded to the bike then the bottom of the fuse block if still dead.  It helps knowing it should be 'hot' even with no key in the ignition.  I was checking with key on and checked the tail lights (nothing) and horn button activation (nothing).
    Year round rider here!

  • Offline Coconut   gb

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    Offline Coconut

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    Re: No Horn, Front & Rear Position Lights or Brake Light.
    Reply #2 on: Jun 29, 2019, 06.02 pm
    Jun 29, 2019, 06.02 pm
    Aah !

    My previous reply was based on yoiur comment ( in the "Relays" Topic ) that there was no power
    getting to the Fuse, hence there being NO Power output from the Fusebox.

    If you have your Multi Meter set to read DC Voltage,
    remove the fuse and connect the two probes of the Meter to each side
    of the Fuse contacts in the Fusebox - you won't get a 12V reading !

    Check the Input side of the fusebox by connecting one probe from the Multi Meter
    ( marked Positive / "+" or coloured Red ), and the other probe to Ground.
    You should get a reading of at aleast 12 Volts ( Main Battery Voltage - 13.2 Volts in my Photo ).

    If the Fuse is definitely good, then 12V should be coming out of the Fusebox on the Orange wire
    that goes to the Ignition switch, and the Green with Brown Stripe wire that goes ot the Top Box Relay.

    If you can access those wires where they exit the Fusebox, as desribed in my previous message,
    you could check in a similar way by connecting the Multi meter probes to the Output side of the Fusebox
    and Ground - proving the integrity of the Fusebox.

    However, I strongly suspect that you WILL find the Fusebox to be intact, with Power going into it,
    and out along the Orange wire when the Fuse is in place, and that there is a connection failure
    in the wiring at the Ignition switch, as per the the Link provided previously,
    for the Ignrtion Switch Wiring Failures Topic.

    Cheers  :821:



    Last Edit: Jan 07, 2020, 08.57 pm by Coconut

  • Offline rpeters549   us

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    Offline rpeters549

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    Re: No Horn, Front & Rear Position Lights or Brake Light.
    Reply #3 on: Jun 29, 2019, 06.20 pm
    Jun 29, 2019, 06.20 pm
    Thanks!  Hence my reason for re-checking.  Will check inside to frame for voltage (even with key off) like you stated.
    If I understand correctly:

    Big orange to frame (ground) from out the backside of the fuse block should give me voltage even when key off.
    and
    Green/brown stripe to frame (ground) should also give voltage even with key off.

    Fuse IS good (checked continuity with multi meter and also tried a new fuse anyway)

    If above tests go that way, it basically confirms the ignition switch wiring.

    If so, I may try disassembly as mentioned in the DIY post to find the actual fault area, perhaps lengthen the wires one by one, and re-route them a bit better to prevent re-occurrence.

    Do I understand right?  Thanks for your patience.
    Year round rider here!

  • Offline Coconut   gb

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    Offline Coconut

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    Re: No Horn, Front & Rear Position Lights or Brake Light.
    Reply #4 on: Jun 29, 2019, 06.33 pm
    Jun 29, 2019, 06.33 pm
    Yes that's correct !

    If you turn the handlebars fully over to the right,
    and look down towards the base of the Ignition switch,
    you should be able to see the black plastic housing,
    where the wires exit it via what looks like a small tube pointing across towards the left side of the bike.
    ( Circled in the below Photo ).  It may be hidden from view by other wires and the Brake Line.



    As you can just about see in the above Photo, the wires from the Ignition switch
    are enclosed in plain black sheathing.  They run across to a Multi Plug connector
    which is tucked out of sight underneath the front left Speaker.

    If you can access that Multi Plug you can check for Power at the Orange wire there  :028:



     

    Last Edit: Jan 07, 2020, 08.56 pm by Coconut

  • Offline rpeters549   us

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    Re: No Horn, Front & Rear Position Lights or Brake Light.
    Reply #5 on: Jun 29, 2019, 06.45 pm
    Jun 29, 2019, 06.45 pm
    I have the lock box out so can easily see that connector under the speaker.
    So sorry for being so ignorant of this stuff.  :159:  I am learning though.  Not bad I guess for a 50 Y.O dog...

    If I disconnect that plug, I should have voltage to ground from the orange wire terminal on the end that leads to the switch (with key off still, right?  If no power it IS that silly switch wiring area)

    Also when unplugged I would assume that from the port the orange wire enters that remains under the speaker is 'dead' regardless as power flows to it from the switch?

    You are being immensely helpful!  I don't mind doing work, enjoy it actually, but have so much stuff to do in general I do not want to do more than I need to to get the TTSE back on the road safely.  12 mpg in the Bronco with a 50 mile daily drive gets old and expensive...
    Last Edit: Jun 29, 2019, 06.46 pm by rpeters549
    Year round rider here!

  • Offline Coconut   gb

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    Offline Coconut

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    Re: No Horn, Front & Rear Position Lights or Brake Light.
    Reply #6 on: Jun 29, 2019, 08.04 pm
    Jun 29, 2019, 08.04 pm
    No problem ....

    Apologies for the lengthy reply - but hopefully it will make sense !

    With the "8 Way" ( 8 terminals ) Multi Plug disconnected
    there will be NO power to or from the Ignition switch.

    The Ignition switch will be "isolated". :



    At the Bike harness Multi Plug ( the "Female Socket" ) there should be 12V at the Orange wire,
    which you can confirm by connecting your Test Meter between it and Ground.

    If there IS power there, there is no need to check any further back at the Fusebox.

    The wire colours at the Bike Harness Female Socket pins are :

    1.  White with Blue stripe
    2.  Black with Green stripe
    3.  -
    4.  Red with Blue stripe
    5.  Green
    6.  Orange
    7.  Black
    8.  Orange with Green stripe

    The wires of the Ignition Switch Sub Harness at the Multi Plug Male Plug are :

    1.  Brown
    2.  Brown
    3.  -
    4.  White with Blue stripe
    5.  Yellow
    6.  White with Black stripe
    7.  White
    8.  White with Green stripe

    The Orange wire from the main bike Harness ( Female Socket Pin 6 ) which comes from the Fusebox
    and should have 12V, connects via the Multi plug to the Ignition Switch Sub Harness Plug ( Pin 6 )
    which is a White with Black striped wire, that then goes to the Ignition Switch.

    When the Ignition Switch is turned to ON, the Ignition Switch White with Black striped wire is connected
    to the White with Green striped wire, so at the Multi Plug with the Multi Plug connected, and Power at Pin 6, with the Ignition ON there should now be Power at Pin 8 of the Multi Plug.
    When the Ignition is switched OFF, there should be NO Power at Pin 8 pf the Multi Plug.

    If there is NO Power at Pin 8 of the Multi Plug when the Ignition is ON,
    there is a fault with the Ignition switch Sub Harness wiring, or internal components of the Ignition switch.

    To Recap :

    At the Multi Plug - check for Power at the incoming Orange wire ( Pin 6 )
    and the outgoing White with Black striped wire - 12V is Good, 0V is bad !

    If there IS Power at the above, turn on the Ignition and check for Power at Pin 8 of the Multi Plug.
    ( White with Green striped wire from the Ignition switch, and
    Orange with Green striped wire to the main bike harness ).
    12V with Ignition ON is Good, 0V is Bad !

    That Orange and Green striped wire then feeds the circuits for the Horn,
    Brake Lights, Position Lights and Top Box Power Relay.

    Cheers  :821:
    Last Edit: Jan 07, 2020, 08.55 pm by Coconut

  • Offline rpeters549   us

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    Offline rpeters549

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    Re: No Horn, Front & Rear Position Lights or Brake Light.
    Reply #7 on: Jun 29, 2019, 08.21 pm
    Jun 29, 2019, 08.21 pm
    I hope to do some or all of this testing this evening. I think one reason I was confused is that I thought power went to the ignition switch and THEN to the bike parts. Makes a bit more sense now!

    If I have power at the multi pin where I should with the key off, not having power to pins that should when ON indicate my fault is in the isolated ignition harness. Power from the battery comes in through the under speaker connector (from the rear of the connector, front of bike) with runs to the switch for ignition powered items (key on items) and to the fuse boxes under the seat.
    Year round rider here!

     



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